TiVo Freezing

[DavidH]

My Sony Svr-2000 has been behaving beautifully since I got it a couple of months back but since the EPG upgrade, things have gone weird.
It "freezes" for no reason. The picture is ok but the remote control and tivoweb access refuse to work (can't change channel, stop playing etc). Doing a reboot solves the problem (for a couple of days) until the next time the problem occurs.

Has anyone had similar problems?

[thomson]

It "freezes" for no reason. The picture is ok but the remote control and tivoweb access refuse to work (can't change channel, stop playing etc). Doing a reboot solves the problem (for a couple of days) until the next time the problem occurs.
Under version 3.0 of the software there is an issue where the system will stop processing remote events. This seems to be caused by a process that hooks into the event system and later stops responding or is unable to process waiting events. It is commonly known as the '3.0 event bug'. To help reduce the risk you may wish to watch what TivoWeb modules and utilities you run. Modules such as 'Phone' hook into the event handler to perform various tasks. It also seems to happen more often after heavy use of a remote control (not necessarily the TiVo remote)... which also implies that a process is not able to clear its queue before hanging.

[DavidH]

Sounds like the same thing except this happens at random. Tivoweb or a lot of remote usage doesn't need to have been "used". The unit is not overheating but I think the daily phone call is linked to what is going wrong. The unit "froze again tonight while doing nothing more than passing the standard Foxtel transmission through but after the daily call was due. Does this still sound like the same issue?

[thomson]

Sounds like the same thing except this happens at random. Tivoweb or a lot of remote usage doesn't need to have been "used". The unit is not overheating but I think the daily phone call is linked to what is going wrong. The unit "froze again tonight while doing nothing more than passing the standard Foxtel transmission through but after the daily call was due. Does this still sound like the same issue?
Yes it does... you should find that you can still telnet to the system... and if you have an strace binary you could try and trace some of the processes on the system to see if you can stumble across the cause. Fom memory, I don't think anything is written in the logs... but I could be wrong.
My feelings are that each process that hooks into the eventhandler gets a queue of a particular size... and if this queue fills up without them clearing it, then the system will enter this state until some of the events in the queue have been processed... so if the application hangs, or is very slow in processing events then you get this situation.
It should also be noted that this is one of the reasons some people with UK units prefer the v2.5.5 image.

[Darren King]

Hi Guys

I can concur with the above. I recently took one of my Philips USA TiVo's from the older V3.0 non Guided Setup image to one of the latest OzTiVo images and it suffers from lockups at least twice a week after almost 15 months on the older image with no problems.

For me it is usually while simply navigating with the remote that does it. Like Thompson says I can still telnet in to issue a "reboot" command but I have not had much success trying to track down what it is that causes the problem however :(

[mnorman]

I'm thinking I'll get a TiVo and hook it up, but this doesn't sound real great.

Is it possible to go back to the older "image" that has proven to be stable if I buy a new unit from the US?

[Darren King]

There are workarounds, and it only happens usually infrequently to most TiVo's suggesting maybe some slight subtle hardware difference doing it. Having said that I have been unable to pin it down.

Anyway, in answer to your question: It is possible but I would not wish it on my worst enemy. If you like manually configuring what channels you receive and on what inputs and want to spend (at best) three hours slaving over manualle editing files and scripts then go for it. If not then either take your chances or forget the idea laa together of owning a TiVo.

Remember, TiVo outside the USA and UK is experimental so never, ever, expect a fault free "service" outside these places.

[mnorman]

Thanks Darren, I understand the nature of the TiVo, but I can't profess to understand the dependency between staying current with "images" and channels as yet.

How often and why are these images released? Who is behind these releases?

I've been reading the various FAQs and guides to get a better understanding, but I can see there is a ways to go.

[Darren King]

How often and why are these images released? Who is behind these releases?



Version increments are very infrequent. For example, V1.3 of the current "Guided Setup" way of configuring a TiVo (very similar to how you set one up "out of the box" in the USA) was released about February 2004. There was earlier V1.x versions of Guided Setup which were released a couple of months previous but these had some bugs that were ironed out and V1.3 came the standard.

From February 2004 until late January 2005 there were several advancements in both hardware and software tweaks which were released as individual patches and these were all brought together in the first release of R1.4 20050203. For those reading this that are running V1.3 GS thinking they are missing out on something by not "upgrading" to R1.4 you are not really so unless you want to start fresh then don't bother if your TiVo is happily running.

The other big important change in the new R1.4 releases is an automated hard disk imaging menu. You simply pop in the install CD and follow the menus, then remove the hard disk from your PC into the TiVo and boot to complete the installation. Compared to anything before R1.4 it's childs play now to set up a TiVo.

The new convention in releases is "R1.4" and the date in yyyymmdd format which is a departure from the old increment of the version number and when first implemented did cause some confusion but people seem to be coming to grips with it. There have been some hiccups with the new automated hard disk installer even though everyone thought things were stable. It seemed that one minor change to it to fix one simple bug has broken others but it has been ironed out now in the current release R1.4 20050524. Having said that there is one *minor* bug in the IP address reporting mail message but there is a workaround for currently installed TiVo's and I would expect another image release soon to fix this for anyone who is still yet to image a hard disk.

Stepping back in time (waaaay back in time!) we first had V2.5 of the USA software which you applied your own file patching and configuring to that *eventually* got you a PAL TiVo. After this came V3.0 version of the USA software which was configured for use in PAL areas the same fashion. The OzTiVo "Guided Setup" releases of today are still essentially built on V3.0 USA software. I set up two of my TiVo's on the old V3.0 non Guided Setup software and I really would not like to do it ever again! Sure they run pretty much like a TiVo running the current OzTiVo software but without the hours of manual configuring!

As for who is responsible for the images, that is a combined effort. Many people work behind the scenes to contribute their time in writing and refining software and others like myself who know not much about programming volunteer their time to test things. Most of the people behind the OzTiVo software do not frequent these forums but can be found on www.oztivo.com and the email group list discussion there.

[DavidH]

Thanks guys. Have avoided use of Tivoweb over the past few days to check and see when this occurs. I have managed to establish that if I simply Tivoweb into my Tivo and just check the Phone screen itself, this is enough to cause the Tivo to freeze later. The details on the Phone screen does not necessarily always match the details of the last call and scheduled next call on the Tivo itself. Curious! I am awaiting delivery of my 2nd TiVo so that I can try and reproduce the error and see if I can track down the exact cause. Apart from that, as long as I leave it alone - it works fine! Will keep you posted as I go along.

[thomson]

I have managed to establish that if I simply Tivoweb into my Tivo and just check the Phone screen itself, this is enough to cause the Tivo to freeze later.
In future I should be less subtle when pointing the finger (see post #2) :), however there are a few other utilities and modules (screen comes to mind) that also hook into the event handler. Just grep the various TCL modules for 'event register'. If you use a module or program that hooks into the event handler you need to try and make sure that it completes correctly.

[DavidH]

In future I should be less subtle when pointing the finger (see post #2) :) Not at all Thomson. I'm the sort of guy who takes on others feedback but still has to confirm it for himself!! Any help is always greatly appreciated.